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Public Perceptions...
09-29-2009, 09:41 PM,
#21
Re: Public Perceptions...
JamesWaikle Wrote:If I may...

I am not a 4x4 guy at all. I own a Journey and as much as I like it I do not think it would do well in the type of terain you guys do your 4x4ing in. However I also have no problem at all with people who do 4x4, or quad or hunt ( different topic there) or pretty much anything really. The trick is to respect the enviroment, respect no trespassing signs and don't be a general all around ass.
The question posed here was basically " how do we seperate ourselves from the ass clowns?"
The answer is quiet simply, groups like yours. You have your rules and regulations and expect them to be followed. Perhaps an artical in the paper about your group would help? Not sure it the Grande Prairie paper has a community groups section but it might be worth checking out.
Exposer is the key, but it comes at a price. When more people know about you then more people will want to join. You will have to be even more vigulant for the people who are looking to cause trouble.

Well put James, the struggle goes on but the guys in TNT - I am proud to say - are some of the best 4x4 enthusiasts anywhere.
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02-15-2010, 11:01 AM,
#22
RE: Public Perceptions...
I guess I'll throw in my .01.... (Normally it would be .02, but some of my points have already been made). The only way to combat idiot wheelers is to steal the spotlight from them, take every chance we can to oppose them not only as a club but also as individuals, and wear that badge on your rig with honor. Its really nice to have a semi-exclusive, best kept secret wheeling club just because its way easier to be a personable club in that setting. But in order to shift public opinion, you need to be in the public's eye to show them who tnt really is. Or else get a media liason who can do it for you. Smile Its the same analogy as the pit-bull used in that other thread. We (my wife and I), have one and he's less agressive than our min-pin. But people dont know that looking at him through the window, they need to get up close and personal to him, then they can see what he really is. Same goes for wheelers

So wear that badge with honor
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05-31-2012, 09:23 PM,
#23
RE: Public Perceptions...
I was wondering much of the negative perception comes from the what i would call high rollers (large lifted trucks with loud exhaust and lots of smoke) that actually never see worse than a gravel road? maybe i'm wrong but I see alot of what seems like ego boosters rather than practical 4x4 trucks.

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05-31-2012, 10:02 PM,
#24
RE: Public Perceptions...
Perhaps, but if there was a group of people with the same goals as ours with large trucks it wouldn't be a problem.
I believe it's actions, impressions and attitudes that the public sees and then basis opinion.
This is where our sticker(recognition), treading lightly and with respect and judgement(perception), and doing things exactly like cleaning up the dunes(exposure) will not only set us apart but hopefully give others a benchmark to strive for.
Bottom line is education by example.
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06-01-2012, 07:08 PM,
#25
RE: Public Perceptions...
There are a lot of people in full size trucks who have the same values as our club, and they ask why TNT doesn't allow full size vehicles, and to be honest I think we should try it out, have an open run and see, just like when trying for TNT lt a pre run before membership but we could do a pre run and see if they would click with the club on runs
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06-02-2012, 10:41 AM,
#26
RE: Public Perceptions...
Make sure that you have a very open /wide run set up. Some guys are not to keen about sheet metal damage.
Alot of the trails aren't very full sized friendly. Perhaps put up a disclaimer against broken parts, scratches, sheet metal damage.

I believe the difficulty of recovering a full sized truck out of a hole is to great, which is part of the reason we might not encourage fullsized folks.

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06-02-2012, 12:15 PM,
#27
RE: Public Perceptions...
The problem with full sized rigs is just that... They are full sized. In general they have a very low overhang up front making for a poor approach angle. In the rear, the box extends quite far making departure angle very poor. These aspects in size often tend to cause damage to trails, trees and the rig itself. In order to get decent sized tires and to maximize belly clearance, you require ALOT of lift. We have all seen these trucks running around. This extreme raise in center of gravity defiantly makes the vehicle much more unstable in off camber situations. The extra width and length of these full size units also makes for poor turning radius. Many of the areas that we wheel in Alberta are very tight. In order to get these larger units through, clearancing of trees and alteration of the trail may be neccesary, and this is not something that we as a club promote. Another factor as Rob identified is due to weight. When a full sized truck does get hung up or stuck, it may not be possible for those of us not running 12 000lbs winches to get them out. Even if we are, if we cannot anchor our vehicles securely, it won't be the full size rig that moves but our smaller, lighter units. We have all been there when winches fail and there is no other option than to pull a vehicle out of a jam. Most of our rigs will not be able to budge a full size truck stuck in 2 or 3 feet of snow, skegg or mud, and the potential for damage to the smaller unit is very big.
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06-02-2012, 12:21 PM,
#28
RE: Public Perceptions...
I've wheeled with a few guys with full size trucks. A particular lifted F-350 crew cab long box diesel comes to mind...it was the winter and a run into Ruby Falls which is a wide trail but the snow was deep. He broke trail for most of the way until he sunk it on the lake bed 3/4 of the way to the falls. Ended up having to anchor one rig to another and use a snatch block back to the winch vehicle to get him out. I do agree that if it's a group of full size rigs together or at least a small pack of them that can help each other out it's better as our Wranglers just don't have the weight to be able to easily extract them without anchoring or possible damage to your rig.
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06-07-2012, 12:26 PM,
#29
RE: Public Perceptions...
this thread is very interesting for me since i'm new to the sport my perception would be very close to what the average joe percieves and beleive me i'm learning alot. like i always thought of off roading as two classes trucks and quads right? but that's not the case. i'm seeing alot of individuals that build a large 4x4 to run around town in and never actually off road, other build the same truck but actually drive them off road . and the guys like me who build a small practical trail rig that works well isn't obnoxious and doens't draw attention running around town and i'm sure there are many other "categories" we could come up with .

my point i think is that educating the ignorant is really the best answer and i think this thread has basically said the same thing?

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10-14-2012, 10:31 PM,
#30
RE:
I want to bump this thread and quote a founding member. Some good points here. Please take the time to review this 6 year old thread.

(09-26-2006, 08:08 AM)YJ_and_Corey Wrote: Ok, here is approximately what I said before the hack-job.

This was in response to what I had been reading on here about public relations, Jeeps stuck in rivers, etc.

---------------------------

The only way, I believe, to really seperate "us" from weekend wreckers, hooligans and drunk drivers with 4x4's is of course, by our image.

But who are we? How do the cops know the difference between an off-highway club that is environmentally sensitive and conscious, and concerned about the sustainablility and perpetuation of back country access.........and a bunch of punks with trucks?

Membership - that's how. When you run a TNT sticker on your rig - it means something. I have talked to local RCMP at various times and I get the same response each time: They know we are a club, they know we have "strict" rules about membership, and they know we aren't the ones they find sunk in the river or out in the dunes drunk. It's very uplifting each time I ask one about us.

The TNT sticker was designed to be bold on purpose. It's safety orange puts you in a different class than guys who happen to own a big 4x4. It says that you belong to an organization that actually gives a giggle. It's an in-your-face reminder that the guy next to you in traffic with an orange diamond sticker belongs to an elite group. A group that is difficult to belong to.

This is why every time I hand them out, to people that satisfy the requirements, they come with a little speech. Because the stickers reflect on all the guys that run that same sticker.....we are considered a unit by most people, which is good but slip-ups in PR can effect us all adversely. This is why I've requested in the past that the stickers be removed from vehicles which are being sold to non-members....not critical but something to consider.

In the last 5 or so years, TNT members have been very good at setting themselves apart from the local punks and wreckers. Keep it up, it's worth it and here locally, it's working.


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10-15-2012, 07:22 PM,
#31
RE: Public Perceptions...
still a good read and reminder. thanks for resurrecting it
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10-15-2012, 07:49 PM,
#32
RE: Public Perceptions...
I think that we should give some guys a trial with full size rigs. I understand the risks involved with having to pull out a full size but it's not a whole lot different thenough someone running a blazer or a jeep 4dr jk or anything else close to full size spec. I know when I go out with my blazer I won't risk getting in a tough spot if I can help it, usually when I do need a tug its not anythingreally rough. It's all in the drivers ability to gauge the situation and know his vehicle. It always interests me to see in places like Moab that they have full size runs and they seem to fair alright. As long as they share the same ideologies the better for everyone and the more numbers in our organization who is trying to keep trails and backcountry open for everyone. Also more members who could potentially volunteer at ace or the dunes clean up.
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10-15-2012, 11:48 PM,
#33
RE: Public Perceptions...
(10-15-2012, 07:49 PM)moonshinerunner Wrote: I think that we should give some guys a trial with full size rigs. I understand the risks involved with having to pull out a full size but it's not a whole lot different thenough someone running a blazer or a jeep 4dr jk or anything else close to full size spec. I know when I go out with my blazer I won't risk getting in a tough spot if I can help it, usually when I do need a tug its not anythingreally rough. It's all in the drivers ability to gauge the situation and know his vehicle. It always interests me to see in places like Moab that they have full size runs and they seem to fair alright. As long as they share the same ideologies the better for everyone and the more numbers in our organization who is trying to keep trails and backcountry open for everyone. Also more members who could potentially volunteer at ace or the dunes clean up.

I agree and it is part of my plan to work this into the club somehow.

The problem is, most of our trails are too tight because of trees or the edge of a mountain. You see full size runs in Moab lots because a lot of the trails there are fairly open and are actually better run by a wider more stable rig.

Most of the fullsize guys around here just want to rip and tear around in a mud hole.
I would like to entertain fullsize wheeling in the camping aspect, not the trail wheeling.

I have a crew cab on 35's that I would like to take on some long trips through the middle of nowhere, and currently on this site there isn't a whole bunch of people that can do the same thing.

We are planning a northern tour for the next couple years, it would be nice to have some friends along for that. Not that regular short wheel base rigs can't come, but I'm getting older and like my camper.

This is just one issue I will be bringing to the table this year.Mrgreen

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10-16-2012, 12:52 PM,
#34
RE: Public Perceptions...
I think that some trails that we have are full size capable and some we can have for just swb. When we get a map thread open it might be a good idea to throw that into the description. Withe a little effort from everyone I think it is something that we can work in.
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10-16-2012, 03:10 PM, (This post was last modified: 10-16-2012, 03:12 PM by jonnycherokee.)
#35
RE: Public Perceptions...
Ill add that to my ideas thread as info that can be added to trail maps. Are they fullsize capable. I dont like adding full size rigs but im one out of the group of what twenty ish? so not up to me. Which means ill facilitate as nescesary.
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10-16-2012, 09:38 PM, (This post was last modified: 10-17-2012, 10:19 PM by little green.)
#36
RE: Public Perceptions...
Not for Full Size on the trails.Catfight Sorry Moonshine not personal...just experience and as the thread title says...PUBLIC PERCEPTION... politics. (refer to "Trails" thread & Membership) Our new President puts it well.Smile Just not conducive to the types of trails we wish to maintain.Cool The current max is certainly max enough.shocked Not willing to put our cause at risk for the next generation. Mrgreen
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